Mopar Muscle Association UK

Just thought I would share with you my story regarding PTTM based in Joure in Holland ( www.pedaltothemetal.nl ) Muscle car sales.

As you guys know Ive just bought a very tasty Charger 440 R/T after about 12 months of looking for a decent model. In December I spotted what looked like a nice 383 4BBL XP29 model on their website. The car was described as "laser straight" and "immaculate paintwork" also "rebuilt 727" and "freshly rebuilt motor" .....Strong words in an advertisement which was later confirmed by the owner via email. I gave the owner a ring ( Fred ) and after several emails and various chats I left him a 10% deposit pending inspection of the car. I felt quite confident in doing so as it does state on their website that "All deposits are refundable pending inspection". The owner wanted me to pay in full via BACS - i was a little suspicious of this and told him no - I would leave the deposit and take the cash with me.

So i drove over there in January with my Touareg and trailer ( a similar trip to the Swedish one ) On arriving at the showroom I walked in and saw the car........I knew STRAIGHT away it wasnt the car for me. There were various marks / rust scabs all over the car. You could see in the light that the body had been poorly prepared before paint ( orbital sander marks that hadnt been feathered out / primed and flatted before paint ) various rust scabs / over spray in the door apertures and the entire paint job had "orange peel" all over etc etc - basically the car had received a $1000 dollar paint job in the states and shipped over to these guys. To top it off the engine wasnt a "freshly built motor" and it was leaking oil ( all around sump and bottom of block )

OK - I know these cars are coming on for 50 years old but £32000 for a premium xp29 in this condition is not worth it ( hence the car is still for sale after 5 months ) If the car was as described - he would have had my money - Hell I was itching to buy one !!

So after confronting his son ( Max ) and stating that i Didn't want the car as it was definitely not as described I was told to more or less F**k Off and I wasn't getting my deposit back. So i told Max that I wasnt leaving until I did as it does say in the terms and conditions of his website deposits are refundable pending inspection - Quote "BUYER WILL GET HIS DEPOSIT BACK, MINUS 10% OF THAT DEPOSIT" ( section 2 )

http://www.pedaltothemetal.nl/index.php ... conditions


So after a little stand off the Police were called and I was escorted off the premises - I was told by the police i would have to take the case up with a
lawyer. Needless to say the wording on the advert has changed considerably since solicitors have got involved ( I have a print off of the original )

Now Im £3200 out of pocket because of Fred and his lies. Ive taken the matter to the European Consumer Rights Agency who are chasing Fred for the deposit and Ive also got a solicitor involved.

So the motto of the story is....Sometimes as desperate as you are to get the car ( or anything ) of your dreams be careful who you give your money to. You work very hard for it and there are con men out there that will lie to you to get it. Always view a car first - Dont leave a deposit over the phone because you've been told that another buyer is also interested..........And be very warey of "Pedal to the metal"

Peace

Wow, what a horror story. Is it this one:



If so it looks a peach in the video, so just goes to show the camera does lie.
If I were you I'd stick a comment on that page pointing out what you saw. Might encourage them to settle up with you.

PTTM were members here.

Bilko wrote:Wow, what a horror story. Is it this one:



If so it looks a peach in the video, so just goes to show the camera does lie.
If I were you I'd stick a comment on that page pointing out what you saw. Might encourage them to settle up with you.

Thats the one - It does look good in the pics and video.... true. Im a time served panel beater / painter so know a bad paint job when i see one. You get up close to that car and its full of Gob ( filler ) As i said £32k for this car isnt worth it - no matter how much these cars have gone up in price...its a £25k car as it is. He has since offered a discount and admitted the oil leak but I dont trust him hence the reason I bought another car and a better one at that

latil wrote:PTTM were members here.

Yeh I know - Ive also seen them at Santa Pod racing a few years back.

The story Ive told here is an honest accurate account of what happened. Im an honest straight up guy - I run my own business and I wouldnt treat ANY customer this way.

What was there defence in not returning you the deposit?

Bryan wrote:What was there defence in not returning you the deposit?

They have 2 types of 'deposit' by the look of it:

TEMPORARY HOLD DEPOSITS:( CAR-RESERVATIONS ) - you get it back if you don't like the car,

NON REFUNDABLE downpay: ( INTENTION TO BUY ) you don't get it back if you don't like the car.

I bet they will say he put money down as the second one.

Bilko wrote:

Bryan wrote:What was there defence in not returning you the deposit?

They have 2 types of 'deposit' by the look of it:

TEMPORARY HOLD DEPOSITS:( CAR-RESERVATIONS ) - you get it back if you don't like the car,

NON REFUNDABLE downpay: ( INTENTION TO BUY ) you don't get it back if you don't like the car.

I bet they will say he put money down as the second one.

Thats right - this was his exact reply......this is their "Get out of jail free", tactic - hence beware of their policies. They did not issue a receipt for the "pending inspection" deposit nor did I receive anything through the post. I mean would anyone just BACS a 4 figure sum to a 3rd party without viewing what they were purchasing first on the basis that if they didnt like the car they wouldnt get their cash back ? ....Not likely !!

Long distance contract terms cover buyers in cases like this ( EU consumer rights ) so what they have done is illegal.

The main thing here is if your running a reputable business and want to give off a good "vibe" you don't pull stunts like this - its unprofessional and unfair.

Raminduction wrote:The main thing here is if your running a reputable business and want to give off a good "vibe" you don't pull stunts like this - its unprofessional and unfair.

Agreed. daft way to do business really in such a small hobby as the bad publicity will have a negative effect on them in one way or another. He isn't out of pocket at all, you spent money on ferries/fuel/time off work etc. If he took calls from prospective buyers while he was waiting for you (which I doubt as it's still for sale), you take a contact number and tell them you will let them know if it doesn't sell. Can't imagine why he thinks he's entitled to keep your money?

Bilko wrote:

Raminduction wrote:The main thing here is if your running a reputable business and want to give off a good "vibe" you don't pull stunts like this - its unprofessional and unfair.

Agreed. daft way to do business really in such a small hobby as the bad publicity will have a negative effect on them in one way or another. He isn't out of pocket at all, you spent money on ferries/fuel/time off work etc. If he took calls from prospective buyers while he was waiting for you (which I doubt as it's still for sale), you take a contact number and tell them you will let them know if it doesn't sell. Can't imagine why he thinks he's entitled to keep your money?

Because he can't sell the cars as they are overpriced for what they are would be my guess.
Cashflow issues due to lack of sales............Could be one of many!

What this does prove though is that you have to get everything in writing.
Did you Email prior to the 10% transfer stating that the money that was about to be paid is on the understanding that it was a TEMPORARY HOLD DEPOSIT for a car you will travel to see.

To which you ask for confirmation of receipt of the email and agreement of the principle of the deposit being paid?

Not that its fool proof, but it would stop the ambiguity and should (in the eyes of the EU), be open and shut!!!

Morning guys,

I am from Holland, and also spend a lot of time on the German Moparforum and various carmeetings;
PTTM is throwing in their own windows, so to say.
They have a very bad reputation.

If anyone wants to check out a car overhere, maybe I can be of assistence.
www.klassiekeradvies.nl
Luckily i have some good references, in comparison to them

Best regards from Holland,
Marcel

Mr. 4-Speed wrote:Morning guys,

I am from Holland, and also spend a lot of time on the German Moparforum and various carmeetings;
PTTM is throwing in their own windows, so to say.
They have a very bad reputation.


Best regards from Holland,
Marcel

Thanks Marcel - I think people should be aware of PTTM and their untrustworthy policies. To anyone reading this post & thinking of
buying a car from them..........well I will let you make your own mind up !!

Matt

you guys might wanna check the german and dutch moparforums;

www.mopar.nl
www.mopar-forum.de

There are quite some interesting posts regarding PTTM

Ive checked the Dutch forums out and with a little help from Google translate it seems that PTTM are a real bunch of crooks - Especially the guy thats had the problems with the engine he bought from them. Quite a few unhappy Dutch customers and German customers as well. Not good for business Fred !!

Yep. This is the guy that bought the engine.

Horrible story.
It's unbelievable what PttM get away with.
And ofcourse it's never their fault.

Bought 600 miles old engine (572Hemi) and after 1200km the engine made such a strange noise that I brought the car back home on trailer.
After opening found 1/2 inch oiltube dented to 7mm internal to clear stroker crank.
The bosses of liftersgallery where cut with grinder to clear gguidelinkbar of rollerlifters.
Al 16 pushrods where grinded to about 3/4 their orgi size to clear pushrodsholes in StageV heads.
Found damage on pistons and damage in heads that was caused by boken pistonparts but they where not in the same cilinders.
Found after talking to StageV that heads where sold to RBRE in 1996.

After talking to an former PttM member found engine came in car to Holland and then was driven by PttM for 600 miles before selling it to me.

And ofcourse it was all my7 fault and caused by my driving style.

Six-Pack Speedshop rebuild my engine and now already 2000 km on the engine and ZERO problems .
Still have same driving style.

And the guys that have issues with PttM keep reporting on Dutch forums.

He's a big Son of a B*TCH.