N2O Advice please... Good and Bad!

[db]

Almost found myself bidding on a nitrous kit for the Belvedere today, then realised there's probably a lot i need to know before i go spending hard-earned cash!!

Present set-up is:
BG750 dp carb, M1 inlet, BG220hr pump
360ci, Barton indy heads, 10.2:1, ultradyne .580" cam, 450-ish hp.
ProTrans built 727, rev patt manual body, PTC convertor.
Ford 9" Detroit locker 4.57:1, Strange S/S 35 spline, 18.5"x 29" MT's

I've been trying to do my own research but now have more questions than answers!
Q 1. If i put say 250hp nitrous through that lot, what will break first?
Q 2. 'You shouldn't use a plate on a single plane type manifold, you must use separate injectors for each cyl' is that true?
Q 3. 'For every 50hp added, raise spark plug heat by one step'. Is this A- true, B- essential/ recommended/ only for racing...?
Q 4. What are the 'essential' add-ons- i.e. stuff you don't get in a kit but the experienced sniffer wouldn't be without, eg gauges, purge, bottle cooler, progressive controller, etc.
Q5. What size bottle for occasional street, once a year strip use?
Q6. How much to fill say, a 10lb bottle?
Q7. What's likely to go wrong with a used kit?
Q8. Do you need a separate fuel line/ pump/ regulator or can you tee off your main fuel line (assuming it flows enough for both demands)
Q9. Would taller gears be a good move?
Q10. Anyone selling a nitrous kit?

Thanks folks

[Ivor]

Paul, are you going to do like me and aim to get the car street legal or race only?

It looks like the set up you already have is well sorted without the gas.

IMHO I would be getting the car registered and running asap, while we have the opportunity!

Apart from that I'm sorry to say I know naff all about nitrous, I prefer forced induction!

[Dave999]

id read

the FAQs and technical section here

http://www.noswizard.com/

and some of the stuff here (he preaches much the same message but is quite bonkers)

http://www.nitrous.info/

and then buy kit from the first fella

although i have no experience in this area

they both appear to speak sense when it comes to the impact of specific heat capacity of the nitrouse line, i.e why you wouldn't want steel braided hose, the evils of having to purge

and the benefits of meetering the nitrous and fuel at a point well away from the hot engine

rather than at the fogger or plate which are both on the hot engine

but as i say just cos it makes sense from a basic sciency point of view doesn't mean it makes sense from a set up and use point of view when most of the expertise you will come across is in the kind of kit that NOS systems produce where meetring is done at the point of ingestion.

Wizzards of NOS seem to pack in a lot of good value into a kit of parts which isn't reflected in their slightly higher prices.
i.e costs a bit more but look what is included and its already in the UK

burgerman the second link....well fine if you know what ya doing......
he seems to have been mates with Mr Wizzard of NOS at some point.
doubt it will be as reliable.

but given the reviews in mags and on the internet of the wizzard kit that i have read, if i was in the market for some of this kinda gear i know where i'd be going.


Dave

[Dave-R]

Too many things to go wrong. And they do. Walk away. Have fun with your car instead.

[Pete]

Paul, get the car finished and registered first.

[Ivor]

Crikey, Pete and I agree on something!

[Pete]

Crikey, Pete and I agree on something!

I think we actually agree on almost everything (can we agree on that statement???)

[Nick]

Q 1. If i put say 250hp nitrous through that lot, what will break first? Shafts or prop. I dont rate the SS shafts, spech with nitrous Your converter could could also say goodbye if its not got an anti balloning plate
Q 2. 'You shouldn't use a plate on a single plane type manifold, you must use separate injectors for each cyl' is that true? No
Q 3. 'For every 50hp added, raise spark plug heat by one step'. Is this A- true, B- essential/ recommended/ only for racing...? Use a plug one or two stages colder
Q 4. What are the 'essential' add-ons- i.e. stuff you don't get in a kit but the experienced sniffer wouldn't be without, eg gauges, purge, bottle Heater, progressive controller, etc.
Q5. What size bottle for occasional street, once a year strip use? Your choice
Q6. How much to fill say, a 10lb bottle? Last time I looked it was abour £5.50 per pound + Vat
Q7. What's likely to go wrong with a used kit? Only Solenoids really
Q8. Do you need a separate fuel line/ pump/ regulator or can you tee off your main fuel line (assuming it flows enough for both demands). Depends on the application really
Q9. Would taller gears be a good move? Nitrous likes to 'pull' through the gears so a lower rpm might be good?
Q10. Anyone selling a nitrous kit? There's plenty out there

[Anonymous]

Paul if you have standard piston ring gaps on your engine then I would avoid nitrous.
To safely run nitrous you need slightly bigger gaps to the piston rings to avoid them binding due to the increased temperatures created.
The pistons would also have to be up specked IE forged and the ring positioned altered for the increased temperature in the chamber.
Whilst a basic nitrous kit is relativeness cheap the add ons needed to set up the system IE fuel pumps, pipes regulators, gauges bottle heater etc bumps the overall price up.
I would say you need to allow a min of 2k for a proper set up if you do it yourself.
However if you accept all that there is no better feeling than having a sweet run on nitrous and knocking a second off you times with the flick of a switch.
As far as road use forget it cos you will need some slicks to make it work.

[db]

Great replies folks, i knew i'd get some good honest ar5e-kicking

Off to bed now, i'll reply properly tomorrow...

[db]

Ivor- yes, street legal. At present i can't actuall work on the car so i'm venting my needs by researching/ shopping for shiny things

Dave999- yes i read the Wiz site. I agree some of his theories regarding pipe, etc make sense but he does seem a bit arsey about the competition! I can't help thinking that if aircraft quality braided lines were sooo awful, firstly racers wouldn't use 'em cos they tend to only use what wins. Secondly, surely they wouldn't use them in aircraft?
Also his stuff does seem a bit steep!

Dave- Things go wrong all the time, one of the joys of owning a Mopar! (you're dead right of course...)

Pete- You're dead right of course...

Nick- Can't find the convertor spec right now but i think yes. Dunno if it's possible to tell from the pic?
It won't see regular use, i'll be very lucky to make more than one event a year and the car will only see occasional road use.
I don't need to win races, it's just for the buzz so for example if the only benefit of a bottle warmer is .01 off your ET, then i don't need one.
Good info, cheers.

Knightcharger- Speaking to my motor's previous owner, it looks like i have cast pistons and the ring gaps will certainly need sorting.
He thinks the crank will be cast too which might be an issue?

I'm not ready to give up yet but it does sound like a dear do all of a sudden!

[Nick]

Looks like its got a plate welded in so you should be good to go.

For the cost of them, you should buy a bottle heater. You'll get a much softer hit if the bottle isnt up to temperature = pressure.

A cast crank will easily live with a 150 shot. Its your pistons and ring gaps you should get right (as Bob says).

Good luck

[db]

Thanks Nick, yup, pistons might delay plans for a while....

[Pete]

I would go for a solid SFI cert flex plate as well, those have been known to fail.....

[db]

Thanks Pete, do you mean as it is or just if i go nitro?